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Excerpt from an Interview with Dr. Thomas Phelan, renowned behaviorist, featured in Dad's Magazine premiere issue.
As Simple as 1 2 3
If you can count to three, you've got a good shot at changing your child's unacceptable behaviors. Renowned behaviorist and author, Dr. Thomas Phelan talks about his "123 Magic" program and offers tips for easy-on-the-child discipline.
DM: When did you first write 123 MAGIC?
Dr. P: The book first came out in 1984, and that was after we had done several years of workshops around the Chicago area and then went out into the rest of the country. Back in 1984, it was a 60-page booklet. It became much more popular in 1990, and we did the "123 MAGIC" video, and last year we did an audio of "123 MAGIC."
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DM: Did that start out of your practice?
Dr. P: Yes, it did. The 123 program really came out of two things. I have two kids at home, and one with Attention Deficit Disorder, so the whole 123 program sort of developed out of self defense. Also, it developed from seeing a lot of people in the office. A lot of pediatrician referrals that were young kids that were driving their parents crazy, but the kids weren't necessarily really horribly messed up. They were tantruming, not going to bed, and fighting. I needed something simple to teach parents to do that would work. It was in the 1970's. At home and in the practice, I gradually worked up this method with a lot of parents and families. We fine tuned it and tested and tested it. Finally, it kept working. So I'd give parents 123, they would take it home, and it would work! So finally, I said, "I'm taking this show on the road!"
DM: For the reader who isn't familiar with it, can you give us a little thumbnail sketch of 123 MAGIC?
Dr. P: It's hard to describe. It takes about two hours to train parents to do it. But I can tell you, we do divide the problem behaviors into two things. Either the kids are doing something obnoxious that you want them to stop, or they're not doing something positive that you want them to start. Those are your two basic kinds of problems. The nice thing about 123[delete comma] is when they are doing the obnoxious, the minor things, like arguing, yelling, crying, fighting, teasing, sibling rivalry, [delete is] you have one tactic that you have to use. The tactic is called counting. Now counting is as old as the hills. The kids act up, and you say, "That's one." But I think we've perfected it in the 123. One of the things that we teach parents is that your silence can speak louder than words. One of the biggest problems that parents have is that they see their kids as little adults. Meaning, they are going to respond to words and reasons. Most parents talk way too much. When you talk too much, you actually provoke a child. Then you take away from a child their responsibility for their own behavior. It doesn't work. The 123 is taking parenting in a different direction. Very gentle. No arguing, yelling, or spanking.
DM: So what it is, is 1…2…3, and if you get to three, you're going to your room or you're going in the corner?
Dr. P: That's right. You hit three, it's the old rest period or time-out. Now I've heard people say, "I've heard of timeout. Timeout doesn't work". People don't understand timeout. They don't understand it on television or on the radio. It works if you do it. The most important thing is what you don't do. What you don't do is you don't talk too much and get too excited. If you want to get real excited with a kid, as in you yell, scream, and carry on, you absolutely ruin your discipline.
DM: Is getting your child to go to sleep a "stop" behavior or a "start" behavior?
Dr. P: It's a series of start behaviors. We have a real good bedtime method. You get undressed, put on pajamas, brush teeth, get in bed, go to sleep. You have to train them. That's where parents get so focused on the counting, that they want to count their kid to get them to go to bed, but that doesn't work. If the kid's in his room and he's acting up, well, that's where he's supposed to be anyway! We have a whole routine for bedtime that involves getting the kid ready a half hour before bed. A half hour before bed, you tell them, "Time to get ready for bed." They are supposed to get ready independently. Then they come back and check in with you when they are ready, and you say, "Okay, fine." [paragraph]The rest of the time left between the beginning of the half hour and bedtime is either time for a story or sitting down and talking to the kids on the edge of the bed. Kids love that, and that reinforces them getting to bed on their own. It's a pleasant time with them, and it helps get them ready for sleep. [paragraph]Of course, when the half hour is up, you kiss them good night, turn off the lights and leave the room. Now you know that's not the end of it! Now we're just getting started! A lot of kids will go to sleep after that. Some kids, for various reasons -- one of the most common is separation anxiety -- won't. One of the most naïve things you can do as a parent is kiss a kid good night and go down into the kitchen, knowing full well that in five minutes they're going to be down with you. They want something to eat. They have to go to the bathroom. All that stuff has to be done before bedtime. So the question is, "What am I going to do?" The answer is very simple. Although it's aggravating, you have to do what we call, "Cut them off at the pass." If you've got one of those kids who's going to get up, you have to set up a chair in the doorway. You sit there with your back to the child. Get yourself a good book; no TV, because that will keep them going. If they get up, you put them back. If they want a drink? You don't talk. You put them back. [paragraph]We did it when my son was crawling out of his crib when he was 18 months old. My wife and I would think that our day was over, and here comes this cute little thing with a grin on his face, proud as punch! We thought the world had ended. We tried to figure out what are we going to do. We soon hit on the[space]"cut him off at the pass" routine. After awhile, most kids will work it out. With some kids, you have to stay there until they go to sleep. If you have a child with separation anxiety, which is incompatible with sleep, the child has to be really comfortable. You can't play games with them, like trying to sneak away or anything. These kids are going to be vigilant, and vigilance is incompatible with sleep. But usually it works. It works pretty well, but it takes a fair amount of endurance. Moms and dads have to switch roles; nobody likes doing that every night. You have to keep your mouth shut.
DM: Kind of tough love, isn't it?
Dr. P: A little bit, yes, for a two or three year old.
DM: What about for an eight, nine, or ten year old?
Dr. P: Same thing. Eight year olds can have separation anxiety. I'm not saying all kids have separation anxiety, but eight or nine year olds, when that light goes out, darkness is like death or something. They think you're gone forever. They get nervous, and they hear the floor creak or something. Something that is good is the floor fan. For many kids, that kind of white noise is very reassuring. I think it covers up some of the creaks in the house that the child might interpret as a burglar or a villain. I remember very well in Highland Park, when I was eight years old, during the Korean War. I'd go to bed almost every night, and the light would go off, and I would be petrified. One of the things I was worried about was bombers coming over Highland Park. I was eight years old! Kids get scared about all kinds of stuff, and these days, you shouldn't let your kids watch the news before they go to bed. You shouldn't watch it yourself! There's a lot of things I think that scare them.
Other Books by Dr. Thomas Phelan
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